Will ver 3.0.8 for Joomla 2.5 work under Joomla 3.0 and 3.1?

[Sophist]

Ah - it was self-deprecating humour rather than self-awareness. Ok.

Anyway, if I follow your logic, you are saying that it is OK for you not to update the wiki because there are also hundreds of others who do not update the wiki. Well, if we all took that attitude in all things then I guess nothing would ever get done by anybody.

Hugh did not refer to these "hundreds of others" and so he could not have been calling them "lazy and selfish" - indeed his comment about "lazy and selfish" said that he could "respect this". Indeed if anyone is inferring that the "hundreds of others" are "lazy and selfish" it would appear to be you.

What Hugh did comment on was you boasting and taking pride in such an attitude and then bitching about something rather than just fixing it.

However, in a spirit of reconciliation, I would comment that I have been very aware that you have been quite active in helping other users out in the Community forum, and I for one welcome this and would like to recognise it publicly.

S

 

[cheesegrits]

Well, actually, I'm still rather pissed about that Libya comment. I don't read your posts in isolation. Rather like heavy metal poisoning, they eventually build up to a toxicity level that I occasionally have to vent about.

Oh, and I always encourage knowledgeable users to participate if they complain about the wiki, you aren't unique in that regard.

Especially if after complaining someone then provides a detailed explanation of something lacking from the wiki. Given that the wiki is now integrated into the forums, no need for a separate account and using a different editor / markup, it's really quite easy to contribute to.

So if with just a few extra mouse clicks you could improve the wiki ... why not do it?

Anyway ... I'll retire to my corner. BTW, despite our rather adversarial relationship, I do appreciate the help you are giving other users, and I do deal with bug reports you provide, assuming someone brings them to my attention, as my doctor has advised me not to personally follow your threads, as it's bad for my blood pressure. So thank you.

-- hugh

 

[Sophist]

Hugh - Believe me, you could not be as annoyed about the Libya comments as I am since it was an insult directed personally at me.

However, in the end I think it says more about Bauer's attitude than it does about mine or yours. As I have said in previous posts, other members can read the threads and judge for themselves.

S

 

[Bauer]

I explained to everyone long ago that I am disabled - have a condition that often makes me 'not myself' - and that includes many cognitive 'issues' that sometimes frustrate me and cause me to be a bit short-tempered and 'mad at the world'. You can add that to the physical pain that often has me feeling so miserable. I haven't been able to work full-time since 1995 because of it. But I do try to find some meaning to life by working when I can to help supplement my fixed income.

Oftentimes, what would take a 'normal' person 15 minutes of thought takes me hours - but I still push on with a determination to get things done. All I can do is apologize for any of my words that might come across as less than 'professional' or 'diplomatic' - and ask you to deal with it.

And there was really no insult intended by the Libya comment - I was merely suggesting the Sophist would make a good diplomat - as you'd have to be really 'good' at it to be representing a nation like Libya. I thought it was funny - but everyone else took it the wrong way. I really don't think I have anything to apologize for there - so I just took the scolding and have kept my mouth shut about it and realize I am dealing with some pretty thin-skinned individuals here. I suppose a lot of that has to do with what part of the country - or world - you were raised in - and that would determine how offended you would be by something like that, if at all. I'm no Jersey Shore product but I'm no Southern Gentleman either. As I've said often - you (anyone) can literally call me an a*hole today and I would forget about it by tomorrow. (Or as they'd say in Jersey- "fugetaboutit".)

You can call me lazy and selfish, but that selfishness - and the guilt that comes with it - is one of the hardest parts of having a chronic illness. It was one of the hardest things I've ever had to do in my life - to put myself (my health) ahead of everything and everyone else. I'm used to people who see me on a good day, standing on my own two feet, and think to themselves or say to others "he looks fine". I learned long ago that the best thing to do was ignore any assumptions people make of me. So don't assume someone you deal with online is generally mean-spirited just because they are having a bad day and let out some of their frustrations on you. You really have no idea what might be causing someone to be reacting in a less-than-civil or 'politically correct' manner. I don't like that side of me any more than you do.

I'm not looking for sympathy here - just explaining the facts - and why I really don't have the time (or ability) to put any extra effort into 'Open Source' projects like Fabrik. And I don't see that changing as I move further into my 60s'. I'm just an old 'burned out' programmer and don't know what else to do with my life that would still make me feel 'productive'.

I am extremely grateful that the fabrik project exists as I think the concept makes it the best tool available, despite never having the opportunity to work with an actual released version of the product. So, I didn't know what to expect when I first decided to use fabrik - but over a year of alpha and beta testing is enough to "get to" anyone - even with a healthy mind and body ....And it often "gets to" me. Yet the alternatives are lacking so I have stuck with it - and despite all my frustrations, would still recommend fabrik to anyone looking to build an application in Joomla.

I try when I can, and am up to it, to help other members in this forum - as well as promote suggestions or ideas. That's about all I have to give, sorry.

(Excuse my longwindedness, but I feel I needed to clear the air.)

 

[Sophist]

Well, in the spirit of cooperation let me clear the air too.

I am sorry to hear that you have a medical condition, and you do have my sympathies for the difficulties it causes you. If you have occasions where you are having a bad day and it flows over into your posts, we can understand that.

However the one part of your explanation which is needed to actually excuse your behaviour is an apology. If you had a bad day yesterday, but today is better, you should be able and willing to apologise for what you said on your bad day - and we would all (I hope) understand. However, your explanation was exactly that - just an explanation. You have shown no indication that you accept that your posts were inappropriate or rude or insulting, and no sign of any contriteness or apology.

Indeed you are showing no signs of empathy for the feelings of myself or Rob at all. Instead you persist with a view that you were not being insulting (by associating me and others with a dictator / terrorist like Gadaffi) and that it is instead our fault for being "thin skinned".

As and when you gain a greater understanding of how other people hear what you say, feel free to try to build bridges again.

S

P.S. Hugh and I are not asking you to put extra effort into e.g. changing the wiki. We are only asking you to redirect the efforts you already make writing complaining or explaining posts in the forum and put them into e.g. improving the wiki instead. The most annoying thing to me about your attitude is that you are clearly capable of contribution to both wiki and code but instead focus on rudeness or insults or persistent whining / complaints. What a waste of talent!

 

[Bauer]

If I spent my time trying to explain myself and apologizing to anyone I might have ever offended on a bad day ? I wouldn?t have much time for anything else. Believe me, that gets real old and tiring after a few years. So I basically just keep to myself and care only about my immediate family and friends I hold dear ? those who know that any inpatient or frustrated outburst is not ?the real me? and understand my situation.

I am also a political junkie. If you knew your politics you?d know that Gaddafi has been dead for almost 2 years now. So in no way was I associating anyone here with Gaddafi. Today, Libya is a struggling democracy. As I already explained, I was simply associating your job with that of a diplomat for a nation where diplomacy would be a hard job or a hard sell ? nothing more, nothing less. It was more of a humorous compliment than anything else (or so I thought). So while I am more than happy to apologize for any other terse words that may have offended anyone or interpreted as a personal attack ? that incident is not one that I feel warrants an apology, other than what I already said ? which is, I?m sorry you (or anyone else) took it the wrong way.

Yeah, I was thinking last night ? maybe I should get into helping with the Wiki. But just like my programming suggestions, I?m afraid I don?t know enough about the project and its? history to feel comfortable writing documentation for it. So even if I do get into it, much of what I write would have to be passed by someone like you, Hugh, or Rob. Also be aware that what I write - and the ability to edit and take my time in doing so - is a far cry from the stammering that generally comes flowing out of my mouth when I speak. (That's why I write a lot when I am up to it.) Like I said, what would take a 'normal' person 15 minutes can sometimes take me hours to get it right. So you cannot compare 'my time' to anyone elses'. For example, in a measure of the worth of my time, for the project I am working on now I am probably working for about $2hr. But I do it because it keeps my mind active and gives my life some purpose.

 

[Sophist]

If I spent my time trying to explain myself and apologizing to anyone I might have ever offended on a bad day ? I wouldn?t have much time for anything else.

That is just bullshit - it takes less words (and so less time) to apologise than it does to insult. You found the time to write a lengthy response, yet you still didn't feel it appropriate to make an apology. Instead you continue to justify your Libya comment with irrelevant facts because it is how Rob, Hugh and I felt about the comment which is important. The bottom line is whatever your intention, we all felt insulted - and you just refuse to understand that and refuse to apologise.

I suggest we call a halt to this conversation as it is getting nowhere.

S

 

[cheesegrits]

It's a funny old world, innit?

I think the last few posts vividly illustrate my point. Time spent all round we could all have used improving the wiki.

OK, off to start the night shift on the forums.

-- hugh